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Author
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Comment
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threeba
Unregistered User
(10/11/05 7:07 pm)
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Passive/domestic "proper" female role
I have an essay to do on discussing the idea that in fairytales the propler female role is one defined by passivity an domesticity.
I chose snow white and cinderella. I am having trouble coming up with a thesis statement. -BRAIN BLOCK- I've been at it for hours.
I've got three different takes on it.
There's the necessity for passivity to make a fairy tale work,
and The idea of how women are rewarded for passive domestic behavior,
and
comparing passive vs active fallen women.
I'm so stuck .
ANy ideas? :(
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AliceCEB
Registered User
(10/11/05 7:59 pm)
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Re: Passive/domestic "proper" female role
Have you taken a look here: www.surlalunefairytales.com/introduction/womenfairytales.html? There are links to some wonderful articles about roles of women in fairy tales, previous discussions on these boards, and also a great bibliography.
Best,
Alice
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Veronica Schanoes
Registered User
(10/11/05 10:41 pm)
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Re: Passive/domestic "proper" female role
One of the issues that has come up before is that your thesis statement is too broad. The roles women play in fairy tales are vast and varied; try delimiting your argument to "the best-known versions of the most popular fairy tales in the 20th century" or some such, and you'll be able to make a better argument. Similarly, you're going to have to decide on which variants of Snow White and Cinderella to use. A good source on Cinderella is Jane Yolen's "America's Cinderella" is in Children's Literature in Education, vol. 8 no. 1 (1977) pp 21 -29. (also in Alan Dundes' Cinderella, a Folklore Casebook).
If you want to talk about romanticized notions of female passivity, I would suggest looking at Sleeping Beauty variants. An early second-wave critique of popular fairy tales is Kiss Sleeping Beauty Goodbye by Madonna Kolbenschlag, I think the author is. I could be wrong about that. It's a bit too black-and-white for my taste, and the author really doesn't take other variants into account, but it might give you some ideas.
Edited by: Veronica Schanoes at: 10/11/05 10:54 pm
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Writerpatrick
Registered User
(10/12/05 6:44 am)
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Re: Passive/domestic "proper" female role
Don't be afraid to dispute the premise in your essay. If you find evidence against it, it's all right to argue against it. You'll just need to give examples.
I would say that the premise is wrong and that women are not always passive characters. It's just the ones with passive characters that are better known. "The Ice Queen" has a female character that's the hero of the story and goes on a quest where she encounters of strong female characters. "Mother Holle" also has active female characters.
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threeba
Unregistered User
(10/13/05 7:07 pm)
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Thanks!
Yes this is all very helpful.
The thesis was given by the proff. The fairy tales had to be chosen from: Snow white, cinderella, LRRH, Blue Beard, Hansel and Grethel.
I'm afraid I did horribly on the essay. I believe you were right the thesis was too broad and I had trouble focusing my thought. Better luck next time. I think we're discussing "the secret Garden" next. Which I REALLY LOVE!
Great discussion spot! Thanks for all the help I really appreciate it.
Threeba ;)
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neverossa
Registered User
(10/21/05 3:31 pm)
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passivity
Hello!
don't be discouraged! can you focalize just on one fairy-tale?
Yes, specyfing which variants are you going to use is the first thing... If you take for example Cinderella you find that she is not always passive... In Basile she is also a bit cruel herself (she kills her mother!) I'd say, and in the ancient chinese tale, she's cunning more than passive. But if you concentrate on the Grimm's one or Perrault's one it can work. I'd prefer Grimm's version because there is the dead mother as a helper. You can also check the tale by Angela Carter about Cinderella: Ashputtle: or, The Mother's Ghost. Anyway try to think of what passivity can socially and symbolically represent... LRRH is punished for her "transgressive actions"... Don't you think that there can be a link between the passage of adolescence and passivity?
Snow White and the stepmother/mother are opposite one to the other (one passive the other active), yet there is also an identification between the two. There's a short essay on the subject by Gilbert and Gubar in Tatar's The classic fairy tales.
I think that an insight in Zipes: "fairy tale as myth, etc." that is a chapter inside his book on THE BROTHERS GRIMM, could be useful. He deals with female passivity in Brier Rose, which more than passive... she's a kind of dead???!?
Edited by: neverossa at: 10/21/05 3:32 pm
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